The "Know Your Enemy" Discussion Thread

[y2kyle16]

Love Most of this alb

Esp Found that soul, freedom of speech, europa

hate so why so shit.

thoughts?

[allisvanity]

Found That Soul is a great opener, really like Freedom Of Speech & We Are All Bourgeois Now. Overall though there is easily more stuff that I dislike than stuff I like on this album. I think Miss Europa and Wattsville Blues are awful. So is Intraveneous Agnostic! Rest is just a bit 'meh.'

[Benny Hiroshima]

A great opportunity missed. The band had lots of press, pulled off some fantastic rock n roll stunts (releasing two singles on the same day and playing in cuba) but managed undid it all with a pushed album with some terrible songs that should have only been b sides and nothing more. It was more Cut The Crap than London Calling. Would haven been better to spent more time in the studio and only put 10 to 12 songs on the album. It was quite fitting that such an lacklustre album would prove to be the soundtrack to the most idiotic phase of my life, which culminated in me being kicked out of northumbria university.

[Son of Stopped]

I really love this album. So much so I made this thread in it's honour http://www.foreverdelayed.org.uk/for...ad.php?t=52982

What I really like about it, is how it took so long for it too click.
There were songs I loved outright from the start, but it seemed a chore to listen to all in one. I'm not sure they meant to make an album that took so long to love, but that's what they appear to have done.

Maybe the two seperate albums would have been better, you could easily make a great 12 track album out of what we have anyway. But that's another "list trapdoor" I jumped over!

[Grant]

It's far too long, too many album fillers. Love it musically though

[Marwood]

"Show me a wonder you can't be sure of..."

I love KYE. Found That Soul is a great opener, Intravenous Agnostic is loveably bonkers, Let Robeson Sing is THE perfect Manics track and doesn't get anywhere near enough respect, Wattsville Blues and Miss Europa... are fun experiments, Epicentre is beautiful, His Last Painting is exquisite in its' own way and a great example of Wire's self-awareness (should probably have been another Wire vocal really), Baby Elian and Royal Correspondent are amazing lyrically and musically, My Guernica, Ocean Spray and Freedom Of Speech... are cracking stuff.

I've never been able to love So Why So Sad but can't hate it to the extent that others do. Nicky's writer's block shows through at times - I'd probably love Dead Martyrs if it wasn't for the incredibly stupid "...all stygmatas" line, and I can never decide whether The Convalescent is a work of genius or utter banality on a par with Razorshite's "She asked me my name so I told her what it was" kind of bollocks.

"...I've been working since the summer..since the suuuuuummeeeeer...."

The album is so wonderfully varied and nuanced that it rewards repeated listening over a long period of time more than any other Manics album to date. It may be sprawling, directionless and chaotic (which consequently made it the perfect soundtrack to the way my life was going at the time), but it is also beautiful and spiky and interesting (and as such is everything I wish I'd been at the time).

Also - Just A Kid and especially Groundhog Days are two of the best B-Sides they've ever given us. Every Manics song should have a Nicky monologue in the middle. Deal with it.

"We're all free to choose..."

Regards,
Marwood.

[UEF]

So Why So Sad and Ocean Spray are amongst the best songs in the MSP canon, imo.

Royal Correspondent also.

Great B-sides, apart from p-p-pick up a Pedestal. Nicky's rap in Groundhog Days should get special mention.

[Diaga]

The album in its 'proper' state I find hard to listen to from start to finish. There are just too many weak tracks.

Regarding 'So Why So Sad', I actually think there is a GREAT song buried in a terrible production choice. Acoustically it sounds fantastic, but the album version is a disgrace.

My 'ideal' version of KYE would be:

1 Locust Valley
2 Found That Soul
3 Ocean Spray
4 Groundhog Days
5 Pedestal
6 Let Robeson Sing
7 Masking Tape
8 Baby Elian
9 Intravenous Agnostic
10 Dead Martyrs
11 The Convalesant
12 Freedom of Speech...

[SeveredJoke]

Originally Posted by UEF

So Why So Sad and Ocean Spray are amongst the best songs in the MSP canon, imo.

Royal Correspondent also.

Great B-sides, apart from p-p-pick up a Pedestal. Nicky's rap in Groundhog Days should get special mention.

Love Pedestal loathe Groundhog Days. It features a terrible solo that is painful to listen to especially with the vocal ad-libs.

Overall there are times when I really enjoy KYE and other times where I switch off halfway through.

Baby Elian is better as an acoustic version and Nicky's misguided love of 'The Shining Path' annoys me.

I like the double hit of Wattsville Blues and Miss Europa.

Royal Correspondant is musically untouchable but lyrically dire.

So Why So Sad isn't that bad but The Avalanches' remix of it is sublime and joyous.

It is messy and scuffed around the edges but that's not a bad thing. I'd agree with the too much filler argument though. It's one of the few MSP albums that I have to use the skip button.

[foundthatsoul]

It's too long of course, but I do love this album. It's the first Manics record proper that I remember the campaign for, I didn't pay that much attention to TIMTTMY really. When it's good it's very good, when it's shit, it's well, Royal Corresepondent.
I rate it well above Lifeblood and TIMTTMY anyway. His Last Painting is just perfection!

[riot_star]

I like Know Your Enemy - I've been listening to it a lot lately. Favourite songs are Miss Europa Disco Dancer, Watsville Blues, Found that Soul, Intravenous Agnostic, My Guernica, The Year of Purification, Royal Correspondant.

I prefer Ocean Spray as an acoustic and I generally just don't like Let Robeson Sing.

Edit: Also not too keen on the B-Sides of this era. I like Groundhog Days and Masking Tape.....that's about it!

[Ken Korda]

Four good songs:

Found That Soul
Intravenous Agnostic
Ocean Spray
Dead Martyrs

The rest of the album can be thrown in the bin.

[Bobafettish]

I think if ever there was an album they 'needed' to release was this. After the success of EMG and TIMT, they turned disillusionment and anger into KYE.
It's not perfect, but it's eclectic incoherence is why it's my 3rd favourite Manics album. Brilliant moments!

[hummingbird]

I have a love/hate relationship with it. I like a lot of songs on there if they come up on shuffle but to listen to the album in full is a bit of a chore

[Tiortranew]

It's the most underappreciated Manics album. Sure, a few fillers (Royal Correspondent f.e.) but I love how ambitious it is and there are a few killer songs on it.