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  #61  
Old 21-07-2021, 11:41
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In some ways it's like Walk Me To the Bridge, put through a happy filter.
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  #62  
Old 21-07-2021, 12:02
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  #63  
Old 21-07-2021, 13:55
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So what’s the song actually about, then?
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  #64  
Old 21-07-2021, 14:54
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So what’s the song actually about, then?
http://foreverdelayed.org.uk/forum/s...8&postcount=22
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  #65  
Old 21-07-2021, 22:27
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I'm finding it hard to believe that standards and expectations have dropped so low that these 'efforts' are getting praise. I get that we would all love TUVL to be good but this sounds like a cover of a rejected abba b-side that the band learned from someone who heard it from a mate that had been taught it by a peruvian pan pipe player.

No band should be so desperate for acceptance and kudos that they lose their own identity. Fuck were they thinking "the Clash playing Abba". They'd be better off with "the manics playing the manics".
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  #66  
Old 22-07-2021, 09:49
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I don't mind what musical styles they're drawn to for inspiration, I just wish that the lyrics of the last two albums were a lot stronger. I'm not feeling Nicky evolve as a writer as I did with Lifeblood and Futurology, despite the strange comparisons they're making with those albums.
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  #67  
Old 22-07-2021, 11:07
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  #68  
Old 22-07-2021, 21:06
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Quote:
Originally Posted by savemejebus View Post
I'm finding it hard to believe that standards and expectations have dropped so low that these 'efforts' are getting praise. I get that we would all love TUVL to be good but this sounds like a cover of a rejected abba b-side that the band learned from someone who heard it from a mate that had been taught it by a peruvian pan pipe player.

No band should be so desperate for acceptance and kudos that they lose their own identity. Fuck were they thinking "the Clash playing Abba". They'd be better off with "the manics playing the manics".
I find this a curious criticism, you say they lose their own identity but hasn't this sort of thing been part of their identity since at least 98? This sort of melancholia with lyrics full of doubt and music full of hope is their thing! I can only imagine what the original fans thought of tracks like born a girl or black holes for the young when first hearing them, it's fair to say many of them thought they'd lost some essential manics-ness after richey went missing but i'm not sure it was any more valid an argument then as it is now. You say they'd be better off being the manics playing the manics but which version of the manics is that? Which era is quintessential manics? To my ears the manics run through this track like the writing in a stick of rock.
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and high and very far away he saw the spiral arms of military systems, forever beyond his reach.
And somewhere he was laughing, in a white-painted loft, distant fingers caressing the deck, tears of release streaking his face.

Last edited by Tim; 22-07-2021 at 21:28.
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  #69  
Old 22-07-2021, 21:47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim View Post
I find this a curious criticism, you say they lose their own identity but hasn't this sort of thing been part of their identity since at least 98? This sort of melancholia with lyrics full of doubt and music full of hope is their thing! I can only imagine what the original fans thought of tracks like born a girl or black holes for the young when first hearing them, it's fair to say many of them thought they'd lost some essential manics-ness after richey went missing but i'm not sure it was any more valid an argument then as it is now. You say they'd be better off being the manics playing the manics but which version of the manics is that? Which era is quintessential manics? To my ears the manics run through this track like the writing in a stick of rock.
Agree with this.

They’re never making another GT, GATS or THB. EMG was a very high benchmark and TIMT did really well.

Almost everything (barring JFPL and possibly Futurology) since then has been panned by the fans and has had mixed reviews elsewhere. Each album is pretty different as well which is some testament to a band who have been around for 30+ years.

Orwellian didn’t grab me, just like a number of their singles over the years haven’t but on the whole they’re still generally catchy as fuck and when the Manics do something right they tend to do it really right.

When they do it wrong they also seem to do things very wrong.

To be honest I don’t think any of us want another GT, GATS etc as it would be pretty cringe for a band in their 50s. I would like more James guitar solos and something slightly heavier, but on the whole they’ve produced some pretty diverse albums and great songs in the 20 years since KYE.
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  #70  
Old 22-07-2021, 22:30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim View Post
I find this a curious criticism, you say they lose their own identity but hasn't this sort of thing been part of their identity since at least 98?
I would disagree, and think that the awful overproduction, self indulgence and cheesy chasing after another bands sound in search of commercial acceptance has only been part of their identity since 2010 with Postcards For a Young Man. Rewind the Film seems to have escaped mostly unscathed (Anthem for a lost cause is borderline) and parts of Futurology and Resistance is Futile were passable but overall the output since 2010 has been pretty pathetic.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim View Post
This sort of melancholia with lyrics full of doubt and music full of hope is their thing!
I'd have said strong music that is shaped by the lyrics whether it be melancholy or uplifting but it's very subjective. What we're getting now, vocal soundalikes with muted background music would not be something i'd couunt as their thing.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim View Post
I can only imagine what the original fans thought of tracks like born a girl or black holes for the young when first hearing them.
born a girl = loved at first but grew tired of the lyrics quite quickly
black holes for the young = glorious then, glorious now


Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim View Post
it's fair to say many of them thought they'd lost some essential manics-ness after richey went missing but i'm not sure it was any more valid an argument then as it is now.
agree with you there, was a bad argument. The essence of the Manics, to me, was James guitar, Sean's drums and Nickys bass with James singing, in different styles and tones, lyrics that were hardly ever accessible on first listen but made you think and want to know more. Whether they were Richey lyrics, Nicky lyrics or Richey & Nicky didn't matter.

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Originally Posted by Tim View Post
You say they'd be better off being the manics playing the manics but which version of the manics is that?Which era is quintessential manics?
Any version that is stripped back to basics (i.e not overproduced - look at any live video of them as a Trio and you'll see quintessential manics) and they're not chasing some stupid commercial goal of 'mass communication' or 'heavy metal tamla motown' or 'the clash playing abba'. they did the abba thing fine on Motorcycle Emptiness they don't need to see how close they can skirt to copyright infringement.

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To my ears the manics run through this track like the writing in a stick of rock.
only in terms of James emotionless but still recognisable vocals. The rest could be coldplay or some generic elevator music trying to hit nostalgia notes so that people will think 'oooh that sounds familiar'
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  #71  
Old 23-07-2021, 19:23
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Marat Sar Marat Sar is offline
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After first listen, I like it A LOT. Great textures in this song, sweeping yet detailed. The female vocal is probably the best tonally I've ever heard in a manics song (so wonderfully beige) and JDB sounds great too.

This is really something for us Lifeblood fans.

Last edited by Marat Sar; 23-07-2021 at 20:54.
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  #72  
Old 23-07-2021, 20:47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by savemejebus View Post
I would disagree, and think that the awful overproduction, self indulgence and cheesy chasing after another bands sound in search of commercial acceptance has only been part of their identity since 2010 with Postcards For a Young Man. Rewind the Film seems to have escaped mostly unscathed (Anthem for a lost cause is borderline) and parts of Futurology and Resistance is Futile were passable but overall the output since 2010 has been pretty pathetic.
I would say that seeking commercial acceptance has been in their unwritten manifesto since the very beginning and i hate the mor sheen of albums like postcards but it's a shame you think overall their output for a decade is without merit. It's subjective though but to me they can still surprise this late in their career.

Quote:
Originally Posted by savemejebus View Post
Any version that is stripped back to basics (i.e not overproduced - look at any live video of them as a Trio and you'll see quintessential manics) and they're not chasing some stupid commercial goal of 'mass communication' or 'heavy metal tamla motown' or 'the clash playing abba'. they did the abba thing fine on Motorcycle Emptiness they don't need to see how close they can skirt to copyright infringement.
That's fine if you personally prefer that but i'd disagree that that's who they were, albums like gt and gats are overproduced to their detriment so i don't see this as a modern thing. And you're quoting nicky there and we both know he likes to fling out those pithy descriptions of albums that don't necessarily match the content.
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Please, he prayed, now -
A gray disk, the colour of Chiba sky.
Now -
Disk beginning to rotate, faster, becoming a sphere of paler gray. Expanding -
And flowed, flowered for him, fluid neon origami trick, the unfolding of his distanceless home, his country, transparent 3D chessboard extending to infinity.
Inner eye opening to the stepped scarlet pyramid of the Eastern Seaboard Fission Authority burning beyond the green cubes of Mitsubishi Bank of America,
and high and very far away he saw the spiral arms of military systems, forever beyond his reach.
And somewhere he was laughing, in a white-painted loft, distant fingers caressing the deck, tears of release streaking his face.
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  #73  
Old 23-07-2021, 20:55
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Someone slight Coldplay? Coldplay write nice music, their problem is they have an imbecile for a lyricist and no sonic aesthetics. I love it when manics sound more like Coldplay. They have all that.
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  #74  
Old 24-07-2021, 09:22
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Both of the new songs we’ve heard have catchy hooks (something JDB has always been good at), they are well performed and have decent enough lyrics. They are good songs. But here’s the thing, for me, as a Manics fan of 23+ years - would I choose to listen to this style of music if it was anyone other than the Manics making it? The honest answer is no, I wouldn’t. It’s too bland for my tastes and the musical references to ABBA grate on me as someone who has never liked ABBA.

Also I don’t fully understand the reasons why they’re making music that sounds like this instead of the possible alternatives. We’ve just heard what happens when Bradders gets a bit more experimental on Even In Exile. I’m not after another THB or another EMG, far from it, I would just like to hear the band experiment with a more interesting and complex sound at this stage in their career. A full-on prog album that’s sort of a cross between Lifeblood and Futurology would certainly be welcome!
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Last edited by Mr Richey; 24-07-2021 at 09:27.
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  #75  
Old 24-07-2021, 09:42
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Someone slight Coldplay? Coldplay write nice music, their problem is they have an imbecile for a lyricist and no sonic aesthetics. I love it when manics sound more like Coldplay. They have all that.
Coldplay have gone off on one with their latest release. It’s doesn’t matter if it’s good or not, you can at least respect the effort to not be content to rewrite Yellow and Fix You over and over for the rest of their career.

https://youtu.be/kWUV5-frRU4

It’s the kind of courage I’ve been demanding from the Manics for the past two decades but instead they’re petrified of failure.
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