Might the whole of THB live be just a bit too much?

[sculptureofabloke]

I'm sure I'll find bits of it quite emotional cos well, The Holy Bible has been there through half of my life now and it's made a big impact on me and the way I see the world, I learned more from that than I did any history lessons at school. I'll be loving it though.

On the other hand going by some of the stuff I've seen on Facebook etc it won't be enough for some people, they really are that fucking entitled.

[Mr.Selfdestruct]

Originally Posted by Takk

No, don't think so. You don't have to immerse yourself in every single lyric at a concert, there's the music...especially with an album like this where the lyrics are pretty indecipherable from listening!

Yeah. As brilliant as the lyrics are, it's the music on this album that got me interested in the band in the first place.

[amaitheanhorn]

Originally Posted by sculptureofabloke

I'm sure I'll find bits of it quite emotional cos well, The Holy Bible has been there through half of my life now and it's made a big impact on me and the way I see the world, I learned more from that than I did any history lessons at school. I'll be loving it though.

On the other hand going by some of the stuff I've seen on Facebook etc it won't be enough for some people, they really are that fucking entitled.

I love how the Manics have affected so many people's lives in such a fundamental way. I think having that personal connection to the music makes you have a different kind of respect for the band. I think some people really enjoy the music but view the gigs as a night of entertainment, the band are just another service provider. If the band don't give them what they want they complain as they would any other product.

I don't often read the responses on the Manics FB posts anymore, they make me feel too annoyed! Some of the comments are vile and I hope the band don't read them or take them to heart. It's hard to believe these comments are coming from fans!

[Lone Architect]

TIHOE = loo break.

Everything else will be fine.

[Takk]

Originally Posted by Mr.Selfdestruct

Yeah. As brilliant as the lyrics are, it's the music on this album that got me interested in the band in the first place.

Also, most people sing along with glee (at least I do) to some of the darkest lyrics around...i find those songs exciting live, not depressing. There isn't time to think about 'oh he's talking about death camps'.

[BeautyBeyondLust]

I have to agree with the comments about what most people are saying on the band's Facebook, it's like they can't do anything right for some people.

On the subject at hand, it's taken time but THB is now an album I fully understand, appreciate and empathise with whereas I couldn't years ago when I first heard the songs, because it took that much longer for shit to happen to me. I'm not expecting them, as middle-aged men, to exude quite so much spite and fury as in '94, but as long as there's some sense of fight... I'll take whatever they've got to give me.

[Bathtub]

I find some of the lyrics to Intense Humming of Evil unambiguously offensive. I would be perfectly happy if they didn't play it.

Granted there are uncomfortable themes and lyrics throughout the album, but that's the one where I do think that if I were JDB, I would have immense trouble getting through some of that.

[UEF]

TIHOE is gonna be my favourite song of the night. Love the music.

I'll be going for a piss during This is Yesterday

[Geranium Terrorists]

Originally Posted by Bathtub

I find some of the lyrics to Intense Humming of Evil unambiguously offensive.

Just out of interest, which ones?

[tzb]

No more than listening to the record is. I know what you mean, but it doesn't appeal to me as a night out, so I passed on tickets.

[Bathtub]

Originally Posted by Geranium Terrorists

Just out of interest, which ones?

You always mistook fists for flowers

Drink it away, every tear is false

Maybe misery - maybe nothing at all
Lives that wouldn't have changed a thing
Never counted - never mattered - never be

Whether you're offended by them I guess depends on how you interpret them and they are obviously nihilistic and meant to unsettle, but I think those are examples of Richey just being crass.

I don't have any problem with Mausoleum incidentally so it's not that I think it's an unapproachable subject.

[Son of Stopped]

And with snow meant to hit the country in weeks (Still they said that last time) then any takers on James's voice lasting the whole tour with no reschedules?

[gallafield]

Originally Posted by Bathtub

Maybe misery - maybe nothing at all
Lives that wouldn't have changed a thing
Never counted - never mattered - never be
.

I always thought the "maybe misery, maybe nothing at all" line to be a very obvious allusion to holocaust denial. "Nothing at all", ie it didn't happen. But I can see how you would perceive that as crass.
With the other two lines, it reminds me of the Stalin quote: "one death is a tragedy, a million is a statistic" in that death on that sort of scale can't be compared with the death of one person. Mass execution removes a lot of the humanity, which, if I remember A level history correctly, was part of the point.

[beautifuldistortion]

Don't see how anyone can find the lyrics of TIHOE as offensive!
It's one mans (if it is just Richeys words) thoughts on an event that clearly shaped the world and was a terrible terrible event.
And not even controversial thoughts!

[Bathtub]

Originally Posted by beautifuldistortion

It's one mans (if it is just Richeys words) thoughts on an event that clearly shaped the world and was a terrible terrible event.

I'd say the nihilism in the song doesn't really convey the horror of the event specifically, more a general disgust with humanity.

As I said before, it's about interpretation. What you may deem offensive I may not, and vice versa. Although there will be agreement on certain things, what is or isn't offensive is subjective. I know people who find 4st 7lb to be exceptionally distasteful. Personally I don't.

Originally Posted by beautifuldistortion

And not even controversial thoughts!

Many people would deem, in a discussion of the holocaust, holocaust memory, and history in general the lines "Lives that wouldn't have changed a thing/Never counted - never mattered" to be a controversial way of viewing things.

"You always mistook fists for flowers" could easily be interpreted as victim blaming.

The line "every tear is false" probably demonstrates how little Richey understood about the sincerity of human emotion and how wrapped up in himself he was at that point.