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  #16  
Old 17-01-2011, 00:42
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Aye, true. Haven't really gotten into him but from the bits of live footage I've seen he looks in decent shape. Ah, I'm a Manics fan, we're not supposed to be optimists
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  #17  
Old 17-01-2011, 07:58
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22/23 is a long way from Springsteenesque - think 35-40 (and a few of them being 8-10 minutes). Bruce takes requests from the audience every night, mixes the whole thing up however he feels like it, and often asks the E Street Band to work out songs on the spot that they've never rehearsed. Bruce is still leaping around the stage, charging into the audience, on top of the piano after 3 1/2 hours of this and he's 61. I've seen him several times and I was exhausted after each gig and I'd done nothing but watch. There's no comparison with the Manics - he's on a different planet on every level.

If it meant they'd mix things up a bit then I'd settle for a shorter set, but realistically the only way we're ever going to hear something different is if they play more, not less.
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  #18  
Old 17-01-2011, 10:55
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The advantage Springsteen has is that his band is composed entirely of musicians, all of whom can play pretty much any of his songs on request. The man takes 4 or 5 requests every night, it's fantastic. It's one of the many reasons his shows worth going to see tour after tour. His solo acoustic tours showcase more material live than most bands do in their entire careers.
This is how I always see it when there are moans about setlists. JDB might be able to pull something like that off, but it's never gonna happen with Nicky and Sean.

You can also expect plenty of jamming from the E Street Band. The Manics recently said they don't like jamming. More like they can't.
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  #19  
Old 17-01-2011, 10:59
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Originally Posted by centralscrutiniser View Post
22/23 is a long way from Springsteenesque - think 35-40 (and a few of them being 8-10 minutes). Bruce takes requests from the audience every night, mixes the whole thing up however he feels like it, and often asks the E Street Band to work out songs on the spot that they've never rehearsed. Bruce is still leaping around the stage, charging into the audience, on top of the piano after 3 1/2 hours of this and he's 61. I've seen him several times and I was exhausted after each gig and I'd done nothing but watch. There's no comparison with the Manics - he's on a different planet on every level.

If it meant they'd mix things up a bit then I'd settle for a shorter set, but realistically the only way we're ever going to hear something different is if they play more, not less.
well, yes, and there's also the element that all his songs actually have a different subject matter. with the manics it feels like the same song over and over.
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  #20  
Old 17-01-2011, 11:58
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You can also expect plenty of jamming from the E Street Band. The Manics recently said they don't like jamming. More like they can't.
That's the reason for their lack of discipline at making rare/difficult songs gig-ready. I couldn't imagine being in a band and not jamming and bashing out new songs in a room to iron them out, but it seems like the Manics hardly ever play new songs as a band before they record them. They probably do, but they should be able to play songs live that they've written and recorded. If Murray and Reed can't play them, sack them.

You learn to play as a band by jamming and I don't think the Manics play as a cohesive unit musically, live. James'll look at Sean occasionally to watch his count offs, the Wire will look nervously at James when he starts forgetting the notes and Sean seems scared to look up from the kit! It's probably the "old-school division of labour" thing, they all have their separate jobs, but it would be good to see them introduce new dimensions to their live performance as they get even more experienced!
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  #21  
Old 17-01-2011, 15:57
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Originally Posted by Dancing Kirby View Post
This is how I always see it when there are moans about setlists. JDB might be able to pull something like that off, but it's never gonna happen with Nicky and Sean.

You can also expect plenty of jamming from the E Street Band. The Manics recently said they don't like jamming. More like they can't.
I think you underestimate nick, and definitely underestimate Sean. He's effectively a classically trained musician, he's not some guy who just bangs the drums.
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  #22  
Old 17-01-2011, 16:48
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I think you underestimate nick, and definitely underestimate Sean. He's effectively a classically trained musician, he's not some guy who just bangs the drums.
Sean's a terrific musician. I don't know how much songwriting he really does but I imagine it's a great deal more than we generally give him credit for.

As for the bass parts, I think Nicky is a perfectly competent Bassist. Even still, it's only more recent music that requires more than hammering root notes so I don't think it would be a massive stretch to 'learn' some older stuff.

I wonder if the reluctance to jam is based mostly in the style of the group. Early years and onwards (as I understand it) James and Sean write music, Nicky and Richey write lyrics. James brings the two together then they learn the song together. Whereas other bands write songs by jamming together, I think the fact that they've never done it is the main reason they never fancied it.
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  #23  
Old 17-01-2011, 19:40
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To be fair I only referred to Springsteen-esque sets to quote Nicky, but I will admit that their sets do not rival the Boss' for epic length...
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  #24  
Old 17-01-2011, 19:58
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It's funny how he goes on about long sets and "lots of the hits", but then starts banging on about frail knees and backs and having to take on oxygen.
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Old 17-01-2011, 21:07
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Interesting points about how the band go about honing their songs there. An interview I listened to yesterday was James saying he gets disappointed by bands that play their whole albums and not hits, which is why they'll always play their hit songs. You'll never get rid of Tolerate, Motorcycle and You Love Us by the sound of it!
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  #26  
Old 17-01-2011, 21:15
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No one is ever asking for that!
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  #27  
Old 17-01-2011, 21:17
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Interesting points about how the band go about honing their songs there. An interview I listened to yesterday was James saying he gets disappointed by bands that play their whole albums and not hits, which is why they'll always play their hit songs. You'll never get rid of Tolerate, Motorcycle and You Love Us by the sound of it!
WE KNOW

And no one asks or expects that, well very few do, and I'm not one of them.
But not all of the songs they play are massive hits, thus the issue!
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  #28  
Old 18-01-2011, 06:41
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Alright, just saying! As the majority of their singles have been in the top 40 the majority of them ARE hits. It's the wanting them to play b-sides and more album tracks that seems to cause the setlist furores. Not that it bothers me that much anyway. Would have liked 'Entertainment' in Birmingham but it didn't happen. What we did get was fine by me!
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  #29  
Old 18-01-2011, 08:08
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Well this will never be resolved, especially when the whole debate isn't even totally about playing the hits at every gig - there's the whole "what constitutes a hit?" thing, which leads onto "there's only about 5-6 hits anyway" and then the debate rages about non-hits they constantly play. I suggested a while back that if people feel that strongly about it that they should mention it to the band after gigs, to which the response was, "no, we can't tell them what to do, they can play what they like". I wish music was more like sport at times - there might be alot of waffle given out by the pundits, but the fans use their right to voice their honest opinions in the face of the manager/team. Some people have said "vote with your feet", but only a small minority have done.

Oh yeah, my opinion is good on them for playing "the holy trinity" of songs regularly as they are what make the gigs for me, plus there's barely another band I like that doesn't do the we're-just-playing-the-new-album thing.
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  #30  
Old 18-01-2011, 08:13
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Well this will never be resolved, especially when the whole debate isn't even totally about playing the hits at every gig - there's the whole "what constitutes a hit?" thing, which leads onto "there's only about 5-6 hits anyway" and then the debate rages about non-hits they constantly play. I suggested a while back that if people feel that strongly about it that they should mention it to the band after gigs, to which the response was, "no, we can't tell them what to do, they can play what they like". I wish music was more like sport at times - there might be alot of waffle given out by the pundits, but the fans use their right to voice their honest opinions in the face of the manager/team.

Oh yeah, my opinion is good on them for playing "the holy trinity" of songs regularly as they are what make the gigs for me, plus there's barely another band I like that doesn't do the we're-just-playing-the-new-album thing.

Maybe we should follow that Sunderland fan's example and next time they start up frigging Autumnsong someone leaps on stage, flicks off the amps and shouts 'for fuck sake, WHO ARE YOU PLAYING THIS FOR???'

Of course you're right, meeting the band after a gig would be a good time to say 'why can't you mix it up a bit more, there are so many great songs we love that you never play anymore'. I've never met them and I know that if I did that and James turned round and told me where to shove it (which would be a perfectly reasonable reaction on his part - if he came and told me how to do my job I'd feel the same) the embarrassment would mean I'd never be able to listen to them again. So that limits the moaning to an internet discussion forum really!

In fairness another PPF tour would shut us all up for a couple of years at least, and I suppose that this PFAYM tour was always about 'mass communication' so Revol was never really on the cards. Looking back I think this tour, in that it was pretty much an exclusive GH tour, not even an album tour, might well have been a one off and we can expect a little more variation next time?

Either way, fuck it, we love them and we'll be there.
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